For Those Whom Need Licesend Dealer. Cadence

Discussion in 'Car Audio Dealer and Installer Reviews' started by jstutman, Jul 2, 2004.

  1. geolemon

    geolemon Full Member

    There absolutely is.
    All equipment unfortunately has its own sonic "signature".

    Don't confuse Richard Clark's $10,000 amp challenge with reality...
    His challenge specifically isolates most of the sonic variables in the amplifier, intentionally regulating one amp to sound like another - using test tones. If that's not possible with the amps you propose, you win $10,000.
    This bears no resemblance to how you use amplifiers in reality, in application, with music. ;)

    Consider this:
    Generally, running a more powerful amplifier, with the gains set conservatively low, will give you the same (or even more) power as a smaller amplifier, while offering you more headroom, and better sound quality all around, as you are operating the amplifier so far away from it's limits.

    But...
    I had a 400w Alpine MRV-1000 amplifier running my three 10W6's in my Civic for years and years - and running hard.
    Alpine makes good amps, but Alpine isn't ultra high end.

    I replaced the Alpine MRV-1000 with an Earthquake PHD2 operating at 4 ohms to provide 1000w to the subs... but set conservatively, likely "only" delivering 500w-600w to the subs.

    I should have gotten better SQ with the earthquake, right?
    Wrong... the PHD2 literally turned my subs into mud. The sound quality was very noticably degraded... I believe even the most novice ear would hear a significant difference, and prefer the Alpine. ;)

    Just one example. B)
     
  2. PolkMM

    PolkMM Full Member

    well...when i said that i shouldve said between HiFonics and Cadence...I've always considered them pretty similiar in build/quality
    is that wrong?
     
  3. geolemon

    geolemon Full Member

    I don't personally think so... but it's all relative.
    Cadence performance is really top-shelf, even for the lower-shelf product, like the Q-series amps.
    I haven't had enough experience with HiFonics to say whether they are "on par" with Cadence or not - and certainly none going head-to-head comparing or anything.

    Honestly, saying they are "on par" can mean different things to different people... performance... measured one way, or by that other spec? Reliability? ...under ideal conditions, or some odd, highly stressed condition? What impedance? Etc... ;)
     
  4. The_Ancient

    The_Ancient Full Member

    I think I am going to impose a new word filter

    headroom == I want to confuse newbies so they can blow their equipment....


    :p :p :p


    I hate that word, in simple terms, if you buy quality amps why waste your money on a more powerful amp and now use it????


    like you just stated geo, the headroom theroy was flawed in your example as it is IMO in 90% of the cases in which it is applied

    headroom is the eqivalant of all the Soccer moms that drive Hummers :rolleyes:
     
  5. geolemon

    geolemon Full Member

    Well, the theory is, many of these specs are not static specs... ie. amps don't yield 0.01% distortion at every frequency, every impedance, or even at any point as amplitude (output) changes.

    So, you could either spend a lot of money on an expensive amp, that doesn't make much power, but yields low distortion specs (for example) even at it's most stressed, highest output state of operation...

    ...OR, you could purchase a cheap amp that makes more power if operated at it's highest output state of operation, but yields higher distortion specs when used that way - but manipulated via conservative gain settings to never reach those high-output / high-distortion levels - instead, yielding lower-output / lower distortion - that would be comparable in power and distortion to the more expensive option - but you are getting it from a cheaper amp.

    The "headroom" part factors in simply as the higher-capability amp obviously has more room to play - it obviously can reach those higher output levels... "it's got more left in it, still".
    ...but of course, often these expensive amps are also underrated, overacheivers - so maybe they do as well. ;)

    That's the theory anyway. B)
     
  6. The_Ancient

    The_Ancient Full Member

    there is a hole in that as well

    let say I spend $400 to buy the Cheap 1200w mono Block to run at ohh 700w for "headroom"

    I can buy a 800w Name Brand for the same $400 and not have to worry about other things like it BREAKING ON ME ;)
     
  7. geolemon

    geolemon Full Member

    Well, I'm not talking about supplanting a $1000 Brax amp with a $100 Boss amp...

    I'm assuming we're still staying in the mid-high end range of things... so quality won't be an issue. B)

    And realistically - I've had some "cheap" amps that were damn near bulletproof... there's some diamonds in the rough out there, if you are privvy to what they are - they might be good candidates for this sort of thing.

    It's also more fun...
    Granted, it won't get you an ounce of respect in a competition (and probably will ensure a loss even if objectively and subjectively your sound quality is world-finals quality) - but it's fun to show up among a crowd of parking-lot kiddies with a $250 system that blows them all away in SQ, without hardly a piece of 'brand name' equipment in the car... :lol:
    (since you are mentioning previously unmentioned potential hangups, I had to add a previously unmentioned reason to grin :D)
     
  8. The_Ancient

    The_Ancient Full Member

    nor was I considering Brax vs boss

    but to use a common example, Replace the JBL bp "I am a Stripped down power house with quailty and and other problems" amp with say a MTX...

    I would pick the mTX everyday of the week and twice on sunday, even though I would have to "run it harder"
     
  9. AustinKP

    AustinKP Full Member

    Yes! This is what I'm looking for!

    Ok, I have a long story that I'll try to abbreviate... 6 weeks ago, I got a PPI PCX 440 (bridged to 160Wx2)from Ultimate Electronics for $150!!! It was a discontinued model that was also on display, but never hooked up, so I got an excellent deal on it. Turns out it was broken though once I hooked it up. PPI will replace it, but with this years model. Problem is, I don't want this year's model since it's now made by DEI, not PPI because they were bought out. I've heard they're not as good now. Also, the DCX 300.4? is 6" longer and won't fit on my back seat where I had the other one. I called the manager of Ultimate and explained this, so he will give me the warranty value towards another amp from Ultimate. Since it's a different amp, I'll probably get around like $300 towards another amp, even though I got mine for $150! The manager himself told me I'd probably make out like a bandit. :D I forgot to ask, but I'm hoping that they'll just let me walk away with the money. I'm afraid that's a long shot though. SO...looking at ultimate's website, the best thing I can find is the RF 801x which is 100Wx4. I'd bridge the rears to 400W and just watch the gains for my Koda. Or, if I can get money instead, I'll need those suggestions. Hopefully, I'll have enough money left over from getting a cheaper amp, that I'll have most of my Koda 10 paid for as well.

    Therefore: (1)How is the build quality of the RF 801x? I've heard from others (namely Cody [PolkMM]) that he's had some problems with them, but I don't know if they're isolated.
    (2)If, in the unlikely event that I CAN get money instead of a different amp, I'm going to buy an amp, is there a "diamond in the rough" that would be cheaper than that $300 Cadence?
    Thanks for all your help guys.
    Incidentally, is there an ETA for the Koda 12?
     
  10. The_Ancient

    The_Ancient Full Member

    you wont take a DEI, but you will take a RF, now that is ass BACKWARDs

    I would not touch a damn BBQ RF amp with a 10ft pole, I would run PYLE before them
     
  11. DerrikW

    DerrikW Full Member

    Yup I was thinking the same thing.
     
  12. PolkMM

    PolkMM Full Member

    agreed...except for the pyle thing...
    but one question...do they have the NEW rockford fosgate power amps in stock? or maybe the type RF amps???
    -Cody
     
  13. AustinKP

    AustinKP Full Member

    OK, OK!!! I get the idea! Didn't realize they weren't that great... wow, such strong replies :) In that case, I guess DEI is the best they carry???
     
  14. WilliamMaw

    WilliamMaw Member

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