What Are Your Thoughts On The Election

What a dissapoining day that was.

Hooray for 4 more years of Environmental Genocide!
This election should have seriously only consisted of New York. Whatever the fuck New York decided to do should have been the determining factor of the Presidential race. The fact that Bush lost New York, the state which defined his 4 years of presidency is a slap in his face. I know NY is a traditionally democratic state but if they dont support you after 9/11 I think the rest of the country should take a hint.


What ever happened to fool me once shame on you, fool me twice shame on me?

 

wow...if all americans were like you we would all take one event that happened throughout 4 years--and look at only that and nothing else
youre right bush shouldve lost...

 

I was only using that as an abstract example but lets face the facts; Bush's campaign was fueled by 9/11 and the devestation it had on NY.


All I know is that I gave Bush 4 years to prove himself and he has fallen considerably short of adequate in my mind.

Fool me once shame on you, fool me twice shame on me..... :bash:

 

You're from IN?? what part? I'm from fort wayne myself (Northeast)

 

Remarkably, the very state who's tragedy he used as fuel for his entire campaign strategy voted for his opposition. Maybe the people of New York saw something about the way he handled things in a differant light :blow:

Holy fuck, who put the big blinders on you?

Ever since Bush has been in office, the life expecancy of Social Security has decreased 4 years to every year he has been in office. This rate is greater than at any other point in the history of the system. What the hell makes you think he is going to make changes now? Is it the fact that he doesn't need to fear re-election in 08 (provided he doesn't destroy the world by then with his War Mongering).

Tax reform? Who do you think is going to foot the bill on Taxes? Do you really think that there is going to be sweeping reforms for the better (in most peoples cases anyways). Were you aware that Bush is slated to ask for an additional $75 BILLION to fund the efforts in Iraq? Were you aware that Bush entered the office with a record surplus let to him by the Clinton administration (thanks to Reganomics, we must give credit where credit is due... the only thing Clinton about Clinton's Economic Policy is the name), and entered this campaign with a record deficit? Where do you think the money is going to come from to fix this? Let's say Bush does reform taxes... that will put us in a bigger hole, leaving the buck to be passed to the next sorry sack of shit to take office.

Maybe you should have read all my statements leading up to this election then.

I find it amazing that so many people are so damn smart and Bush is the real deal, but when confronted with facts, everone so in the know has nothing to say in return. Either that or the twist the truth and deliver half truths.

Dan's statements about job creation and his proof of such jobs only displayed 1/2 the facts. His proof showed 2 million new jobs, but he neglected to ask you to look at the unemployment numbers in that period of time. On the very same site you may select unemployment and see that durring that period 3.6 million new people entered unemployment. But see, that is typical. It is no flaw of Dans, but a shortsightedness of people searching for the truth. Dan lives in a part of the country that is going against the norm, where growth is occuring at a tremendous rate. Try coming here where farming, and textiles, and technology, and tobbacco are the primary industries. All of these industries are collapsing. This is not only happening here, look at the figures all over the country. I feel this worse than most people do, as my living is based purely on commission from people involved in these industries. In 1999 I made over $80,000. Last year I made LESS THAN HALF that. I made $20,000 less last year than I did the year before. That equates to $1,666 less PER MONTH than the year before.

That doesn't even take into account the effect the stock market has had on my future. I have invested it the way that Bush wanted it to be invested, in private individual stock purchases... that is our SS reform package. Sounds great!!! In the last 4 years I have lost everything I had, over a quarter of a million dollars in investments is GONE

I think it sucks that that motherfucker is back in office. People are so blind and afraid of change it isn't even funny. Try looking at reality instead of half truths and bullshit.

 

What do you plan on doing when you get old Mike? If SS isn't there, what do you have to support yourself? See, people don't take into consideration what will happen as they get older. Are you telling me all the money you have dumped into SS (and I know you are young, but still, we all put money in every week) you would like to see pissed away? I have put alot of my hard earned money into SS, and I for one would love to see a return on my investment.

My money was invested in the market. Durring the Regan years I made money, durring the Clinton years I absolutely flourished, but amazingly durring the Bush years (like father like son) I lost alot of money. I don't know what markets you have been watching but this:

is utter bullshit man. The market is collapsing, the interest rates dropping to all time lows are great proof of that. The saturated housing market due to repos is further proof of what has happened in the market. S&P is down, the Dow is WAY down, the NASDAQ is down... blue chips are through the floor, banks are merging to alleviate fears of closing. What fuckin markets do you see up? The Canadian Market?

As far as your fathers investment... 6% over it's lifetime? That sucks. I could put my money in a savings account and gain more interest than that in 2 years. I could go to my local bank and deposit $1000 in a savings account and gain 5% ANNUALLY, not over the life of the account. If I put in $5000, I could get 6% and 6.5% for any amounts over $10,000. Durring the Clinton years I'd put my gains at almost 1000%. My personal financial input was about $25,000-$35,000 and I lost almost a quarter of a million durring Bush 2. THAT is financial prosperity and financial pitfalls.

The IRS should have been left alone, along with the tax rates durring the Clinton administration. All this bullshit about Kerry's having paid so little in taxes last year is just such a great example of what the Bush Admin has done to our tax structure. The rich pay less, and the middle class get fucked. You know what? Taxation is simply required, that's all there is to it. Everybody speaks of freedom and what the government should do for them, then they turn around and bitch about the cost... But let's send troops overseas to end the oppression of other countries. Boy, people really don't look at the whole picture do they.

We could save a fortune and grow so much more prosperous if we were to use our tax dollars for US, not for them.

Taxes are simply a requirement, for us and our kids. I want my kids growing up in a great nation and I am willing to pay for it. I don't ask for hand outs, from anyone, and I am willing to do my part to keep this nation so great. I am not going to tell the government to go fuck themselves about taxes. I feel the poor should pay a smaller percentage than the middleclass, who should similarly pay a smaller percentage than the upper class. I don't see why some single mother with 2 kids who's ex left her and never paid child support should have to pay a greater portion of her income in taxes then me. and I don't see why I should pay 12 cents to the dollar I earn when someone turning 2 mill a year pays a nickle... plus breaks on his long term investments and holdings.

People are so busy saying "Me, me, me" that they are forgetting that this is a nation of over a billion people... this is about we, all of us, especially the little people. It is those of us who are middleclass and poverty level that make up the majority of this great nation, and we need to stand together.

With regaurds to the LP. They would ruin this nation with the same greed as the big parties... but they would have less of an understanding of how big these fuckups they made would be untill it was too late.

I am a republican (I put that in lower case as I am embarassed by our chief representative), but I am not blinded by party lines. We could use a man like Regan... or another Clinton who saw the brilliance in Regan's method again.

 

you continually talk bad about bush, yet have nothing good to say about Kerry
no one is perfect, bush is far from the best president ever--but is lightyears above kerry
i honestly have no idea why people voted for kerry--you can not honestly say that you know what hes going to do
his views differ depending on what part of the country hes in. he gets called out for it and denies it
as far as the stock market going down--i think that has A LOT more to do with 9/11 and terrorist threats than Bush
the war in Iraq could very well be helping the stocks
what if we didnt go to Iraq and more terrorists came...what would happen then?
stocks would drop
what would you have done after 9/11? if he hadnt done anything, people would have bitched at him for not doing anything...so he did something about it and people still bitch--people just have a tendency to bitch
everyone blames the President for everything that goes wrong. why? because hes an easy target. hes the head of the country so if something goes wrong it has to be his fault right??
its peoples nature to blame other people for their problems
bush is not the best president, but by far not the worst...and light years ahead of Kerry
-Cody

 

hmmm, well I thought I fixed it, maybe I didn't...

Oh, and I need to state, I may get fired up about this (but I think if you read what I have been through in the last 4 years you can understand why) but in no way do I consider politics a reason to get personal with, and begin hating my friends... But I do openly and hashly discuss things as I see them...

It is not intended as personal, My appologies if I get overly fired up.

 

Your first statement was so true, and I felt maybe you were seeing the light, then I read the rest of it and thought WTF???

I never said anything good about Kerry, but I have said he belongs in office more than Bush does. Even if you don't agree with anything I say, consider this...

The Democrats didn't push really hard for Kerry did they? Wanna know why? Hillary Clinton is being groomed for office in '08. Think about that for a second. Hillary could easily walk over almost anyone the Republicans have set to run for office. God Knows, I would love to see Rudy Guliani run for office, and he may stand a chance, but that is unlikely with his cheating scandal. So who is poised to run against Hilly? Would it scare you to know Condelista Rice is being considered? Did you know she is slated to drop he position in the cabinet to begin grooming for this office? Hilly is really scary, But Rice is REALLY fuckin scary. Which is the lesser of 2 evils there? I am sorry, but we don't need a woman running our country. I don't mean to sound sexist, but women do base decisions on emotion, and men on intelligence (another reason Bush should not be in office... his lack thereof ). Last thing we need is Hilly on PMS arguing with North Korea :blink: . That and the fact that no other nation in the world would look at us the same way again if a woman were running things... it is just not accepted in the world.

9-11 was 4 years ago. How can you continue to blame 9-11 for evrything going wrong in this country? Have you ever considered the massive job loss in the country not allowing people to buy products or stocks so these companies can grow in their new buildings overseas? Were you also aware it was the Bush administration who took NAFTA a step further and allowed this to happen overseas? Why is it people are so hung up on 9-11? Everybody seems to behave like this was something new. Terrorists have continually attempted acts like this, only to be thwarted. But we the people didn't know. Intelligence is stunning, believe it or not and alot goes on behind closed doors that you and I have no idea about. So Bush fucks up and this occurs, and he uses his mistake to garner support for his vendetta with Saddam (who I will agree the world is a better place without him). How the hell do these 2 coincide? Bin Ladin is in Afganistan, and Bush's daddy helped arm him, and we attack Saddam citing security concerns and terrorist threats. HUH? SO he makes a serious mistake in judgement, and then uses it to support his war against someone who had nothing to do with it, and blames all of America's problems on it? You say this is acceptable?

These threats have been very real, and have occured on numerous occasions in the past... this is not the first time. The Bombing of the Towers so many years ago, remember that? What did slick Willy do after that? Did the stock market collapse? Yet you think that there would have been a differance only because Bush was in office? Were people bitching durring his re-election about the way he handled it? Was the UN in total disagreement with his actions? Were we looked at by the world community as domineering war-mongering radicals?

The subsequent terrorist threats? Lemme ask you this... when was the last really viable terrorist threat in America? 9-11? BINGO!!! The government has simply forcefed fear into Americas hearts. As I stated above, these threats have been occuring for decades, but the government hasn't used them to make the people afraid to go out of their homes and garner a few job approval points.

You say Bush isn't the best president ever? I agree. You say he isn't the worst president ever? I ask you then... who was? Cause on that note I disagree 100%.

I find something you state interesting though:

bush is not the best president, but by far not the worst...and light years ahead of Kerry

How do you know this? Is it because Kerry was president before and I was in one of my blackouts? I just find that statement of "fact" extremely perplexing.

 

In response to Polk:

Im really not in the mood to fight about Bush and Kerry because this subject has been beaten to death already for me.

What I will say is that Iraq has more terrorists now than before we invaded the country. Iraq might have been turning a blind eye to terrorism or even funding it on some level but you must realize that terrorism goes beyond Al-Qaeda. If we wanted to capture Bin Laden, Iraq should not have been our primary target. Look at the shithole we are in now. Billions in debt, in charge of rebuilding a country by ourselves and have no exit strategy. The fight on terrorism cannot be won by traditonal use of force. You cannot destroy a concept by sending military force into countries harboring terrorists. If thats Bushs plan then we better pack our shit and get ready to invade half the world. Terrorists FLOURISH because they can fit into their sourroundings and fit in with the people of the country. What good is using the military if you dont know who you are fighting. You could be shaking a terrorists hand in the day and having him blow your head off at night. This was precisely the problem in Vietnam. We didnt know who the fuck we were fighting, killed a bunch of innocent people and just got the people of the country to hate us more and resist our occupation. If we want to win the "war" on terrorism we must isolate the terrorists. We must provide the people of the countries a reason not cooperate with terrorists and allow them to fit in. I could go on about this more and get more specific but I know if I start I just wont stop.


So ill just go watch some boxing.... :boxing:

 

Fear that Mike. Those statements are not bullshit. The grooming of Hilly has been common knowledge, but the reason for vacancy by Rice is fairly fresh information, about a week or 2 old or so. The Republicans may very well be right, their only chance of beating Hillary may be Rice. And that scares the shit out of me.

A very simple fact, if that begins to really take shape I will move to a differant country. My wife has been mentioning wanting to move to Italy... If those 2 are preparing their run for office my wife will get her way. :bag: