What Are Good 8" Midbass/bass Drivers?

Discussion in 'General Car Audio Discussions' started by Feandil, Jan 12, 2004.

  1. Feandil

    Feandil Full Member

    Hey.... I really don't like CAF too much anymore so I'll post my question here ;)

    What is a good 8" midbass/bass drivers for around $100... maybe a little more. I'm looking for it to play as low as possible (20+ hz if possible) and play well up to 3500 hz ideally.... (Orion p6.2s are crossed at this)

    I can settle with crossing it at 2 khz, maybe less, but ideally 3500 hz. If perfection was possible it'd play 22 hz-3500 hz... but I can also just have this as a dedicated midbass and cross it at 600-1000 hz....
    Also it needs to take around 200-300 watts RMS (single 8 ohm or DVC 4 ohm are preferable)

    Right now I'm thinking a Vifa 8" (partsexpress)
    RE 8"
    ED 8A
    ScanSpeak 8" woofer
    Focal 8" woofer
    Kicker Comp VR 8"
    JL w6 8"

    The RE 8" is the front runner right now....
    Thanks fellers :p

    Matt

    Edit: Oh yea I forgot.... It's probably gonna be IB for SQ purposes... I can seal if absolutely (fiberglass work involved) necessary... ;)
     
  2. Feandil

    Feandil Full Member

    I just found the ID V3 8" for only $90... I want a lot of output from the midbass so would this work? Plus ID is known for excellent SQ :)
     
  3. peter_euro

    peter_euro Full Member

    LOL, you gotta make up your mind... either you want a midbass or a subwoofer... to play down to 20, you will have to enclose the speakers... and your choices are more in subwoofer cat than in midbass.. if you want them play down to 20, you certainly do not want to lo pass them at 2k either...If you want a mid, you want something that is very musical and can hit pretty fast... Something like Morel, Illusion Audio or Dynaudio midbass drivers... You are planning to use regular subwoofers, right?
     
  4. Feandil

    Feandil Full Member

    yea I'm using 2 15 L7s

    my 4 channel amp can't hp and lp at the same time so I'm kinda limited there, I already have Orion p6.2s.... Bi-amped getting 200+ watts RMS per side
    They aren't enough midbass (what I call midbass)

    Is there any mids that restrict the frequencies they play without external crossovers?

    I'm actually thinking to just use the Orion's as dedicated midbasses and getting 2 4" midranges now.... either way it seems like I need another external crossover :(
     
  5. Feandil

    Feandil Full Member

    Ok I've basically figured out what I want now...

    This is my idea....

    A Vifa PL 7" for the dash... it'll play 80 hz-3500 hz like the Orion mids are now... that way it will bring the staging up with the tweets and it'll add the extra midbass I want...

    Good idea?

    I was also thinking of just restricting the orion mids to 80-400 hz and having the 7" playing 400-3500 hz where the tweets would pick up...

    Which one is best?

    Gracias

    Matt
     
  6. peter_euro

    peter_euro Full Member

    what on earth are you driving that allows you to fit 7in drivers in your dash? and I think that you may seriously consider switching to an active crossover... Very difficult to pick the right frequencies the first time around without trial and error since in car response can be so unpredictable... ;)
     
  7. Steven Kephart

    Steven Kephart Full Member

    Hehe. I have a 10 in my dash. :)
     
  8. peter_euro

    peter_euro Full Member

    Hehe. I have a 10 in my dash. :) [/b][/quote]
    must be one of those cabin waaaay forward designs... LOL... My compliments for stopping the rattles and keeping the gauges functional... unless you mean under the dash and firing downward... My oh my... given enough time, tools and skills what people can come up with... :rolleyes:
     
  9. sandt38

    sandt38 Full Member

    The PLs will begin to break up at 1500Hz or so. Not really a great choice to pass so high, they are definately midbass not midrange. I'd suggest 6-800Hz down to 50 or 60Hz for the PLs (and they will spank too man, nice midbass). Let your tweets work the 2KHz and up, and get a dedicated midrange to fill in the gap.

    Either that or hang on for a bit for the RE XBL2 enabled comps, about $130 I think Chris (Geolemon) said for the stamped basket set, while the cast Extremis set will run a bit over $200. Chris really seemed to like the set, so....
     
  10. geolemon

    geolemon Full Member

    must be one of those cabin waaaay forward designs... LOL... My compliments for stopping the rattles and keeping the gauges functional... unless you mean under the dash and firing downward... My oh my... given enough time, tools and skills what people can come up with... :rolleyes: [/b][/quote]
    He's got a 10" Brahma, under his dash, over his transmission hump, actually inverted out of it's enclosure so you can see the magnet.

    Stephen...
    Do you have any other subs in your car, in fact?
     
  11. geolemon

    geolemon Full Member

    Active crossover ie. "active filters" (ie. amplifier "built ins") = bad.
    Not bad in their quality, or slope, or anything like that... it's more fundamental.
    A true "crossover" is a coordinated pair of HP and LP filters, coordinated in such a way that true to their design, either the frequency response, or phase response (or some compromise of each) is preserved across the crossover point... because the two drivers relatively slow attenuation in either direction means that around the crossover point, both drivers will be contributing to the total output of the system.
    It's darn near impossible to try to coordinate two separate filters... say, a HP built into one amp, and a LP built into another amp. There's no coordination, it's a fundamental elimination of the actual design of the crossover. Who cares if it's a Butterworth or Linkwitz-Riley or Bessel, if they aren't actually coordinated together properly? ;)

    Active crossover ie. Active crossover = good.
    But that's often expensive, and it's a separate, outboard device, that makes your amplifier's built-in processing obsolete.

    Passives, being non-adjustable by nature, and following known design standards, are often your best bet for maintaining proper SQ.
    Most high-end, high-dollar home audio comp systems use passive Xovers... and it's not for reasons of budgetary constraint. :p
     
  12. Feandil

    Feandil Full Member

    what on earth are you driving that allows you to fit 7in drivers in your dash? and I think that you may seriously consider switching to an active crossover... Very difficult to pick the right frequencies the first time around without trial and error since in car response can be so unpredictable... ;) [/b][/quote]
    LOL... the dash hole is actually around 9" around stock :p

    The speaker cover over the 6.5" stock speaker is WAY too big. It's a volvo S80 :)

    I actually could fit a 10" sub in the dash... I was thinking about that for awhile, then I wanted a midbass driver...

    Maybe I should just do this.... Since I feel the midbass is lacking... just get an ID V3 10" invert it in the dash and make it a dedicated midbass....

    What exactly would that cause staging wise?

    Have the loud midbass high up, and have the Orion's still playing midbass in the doors...

    And please tell me how exactly one moves from passive to active.
    Is a very large multiple band adjustable crossover needed?

    Thanks
    Matt
     
  13. Feandil

    Feandil Full Member

    Ok... thanks chris

    I'd like to keep my Orion passives if possible...
     
  14. Feandil

    Feandil Full Member

    Well If the ID won't mess up staging that bad I'd really wanna get that. Because it could play down to 10 hz or so free-air and that would fill in missing notes (10 hz - 25 hz) that my subs are missing... plus it'd be an extra midbass playing up to 300 hz...
    Then I could either HP the Orions at 80 hz for midbass overlap... or cross them at 300 hz for no overlap. That way the Orions would be midranges basically with the ID taking over midbass and subsonic bass...

    Sounds like a good plan to me... eh?

    Thanks :bye:
     
  15. Fryguy

    Fryguy Full Member

    geo, or you can buy an amp like mine that has a true active x-over built in :)
     
  16. geolemon

    geolemon Full Member

    Definitely... as long as it's real.

    Our 1600M1 had one built in...
    You set the LP for the subs that you'd run off the amp, and it had a nice slave RCA output that was a coordinated HP.

    Sometimes, you can find them built in... :yes:
    Sometimes, you aren't as lucky. :no:

    What amp do you have with that, Fry?
     
  17. sandt38

    sandt38 Full Member

    All Z A and ZRS Cadence amps have the same feature. In fact, you can select full range, or high pass or low pass at the same frequency. Slick if you want to run multiple amps for multiple subs too... it takes the guesswork out of setting multiple crossovers. Just set one and you are done.
     
  18. Steven Kephart

    Steven Kephart Full Member

    Nope, just the Brahma. All I run is the Koda's and the B10, all up front which works great.

    After visiting Adire a while back and hearing a B15 play a 10 kHz note, I have since wanted to do a demo car featuring a B15 on each side of the dash, along with a tweeter. I know that it wouldn't sound very good in that the B15 wouldn't have flat response, and probably some cone breakup. But it probably would sound fairly decent with some processing and would be VERY impressive to show off. B)

    Unfortunately it would cost a LOT of time and money, the latter I greatly lack. I think realistically I would be stuck using 10's on each side so I wouldn't have to make the vehicle a center seater. But then that would be fun as well.